Moreover, surrendering whatever Russia sticks a flag in is appeasement nonsense. We’ve already seen this strategy before WWII: *oh, Germany will be OK if we just cede Czechoslovakia. Oh, Germany won’t attack if we cede Alsace-Lorraine…" An aggressive power like Russia, who already tried to annex large portions of another sovereign nation in 2008 (they invaded Georgia and got their shit kicked in because they tried the whole “three day thunder run” strategy), almost certainly will not stop if you just “give them what they want”. Eventually, they’ll want more, and more, and more, and you wind up surrendering slice after slice after slice of your country.
Except that the cuban missle crises shows the US completely disagrees (unless it is convenient at that moment). Do you not see how this war was 100% avoidable if nato did not cross the directly drawn line?
You are correct that they didnt offer it yet, but it was on the table, and NATO knew that was the reddest of red lines. You also do even know why russia took over Crimea in the first place.
And yes, how america would react is imporant because it shows how we really feel, not just propaganda about how they can do what they please.
Russia doesn’t get to dictate what sovereign nations do. They can fuck off back to their own country, that would put an immediate stop to the war.
Thats true, but what if we had listened to them and prevented hundreds of thousands of dead people? Why would that have been bad?
What if they had listened to us and not fucking invaded a sovereign nation? Why would that have been bad?
Moreover, surrendering whatever Russia sticks a flag in is appeasement nonsense. We’ve already seen this strategy before WWII: *oh, Germany will be OK if we just cede Czechoslovakia. Oh, Germany won’t attack if we cede Alsace-Lorraine…" An aggressive power like Russia, who already tried to annex large portions of another sovereign nation in 2008 (they invaded Georgia and got their shit kicked in because they tried the whole “three day thunder run” strategy), almost certainly will not stop if you just “give them what they want”. Eventually, they’ll want more, and more, and more, and you wind up surrendering slice after slice after slice of your country.
So then nato gets to constantly aggress on them and they cant do anything? And then you are shocked that they invaded.
“Aggress on them” by existing on their border? This is apologist and appeasement nonsense. Russia’s rights end at their borders.
Except that the cuban missle crises shows the US completely disagrees (unless it is convenient at that moment). Do you not see how this war was 100% avoidable if nato did not cross the directly drawn line?
Comparing them to our imperialist actions isn’t the brilliant argument that you think it is.
At any rate, NATO has never offered membership to Ukraine — they’ve been explicitly told their corruption issues were a non-starter.
And, of course, Ukraine only started those talks following Russia invading Crimea in 2014. Again, Russia is the clear aggressor here. Get real.
You are correct that they didnt offer it yet, but it was on the table, and NATO knew that was the reddest of red lines. You also do even know why russia took over Crimea in the first place.
And yes, how america would react is imporant because it shows how we really feel, not just propaganda about how they can do what they please.