It’s nuts that this is barely even news. Like… another day another atrocity.
I’m trying not to be numb to it, but it’s hard to remain shocked. I’m still disgusted, though.
I’ll say this, too: I think we too often judge wars by the conduct of the participants as though there are good wars and bad ones. And my hunch is that it’s more like there are bad ones and terrible ones, and as awful as this sounds, this one is more notable because it’s being well documented and it involves a uniquely fucked up context (decades of occupation with the support of the US). I think the way the Israeli right wing discusses it is uniquely brazen, and the degree to which the IDF targets journalists and medics seems high, but I think that this kind of stuff happens so often and is undercovered. I wish Yemen got the kind of coverage this is getting.
In terms of the atrocities, I think most wars are basically just a bunch of atrocities in a trenchcoat. It doesn’t make these any better: I just want this to end, and then all the other wars. Fuck this shit.
AND I want the people who do this shit dragged in front of the Hague. I’m very glad that Netanyahu and Gallant have had arrest warrants requested, but you know what I call that? A good start.
Those are valid targets. Oh and also hamas is often just killing or bombing people and saying it was Israel, see the hospital parking lot incident.
However i do agreed that Netanjahu belongs in front of a court. Just as every single hamas terrorist that isn’t killed in this war, justice has to be served no matter how moraly right some of these crimes may seem to some
I really try not to get into litigating each and every instance, but I feel compelled sometimes to point out a few things:
The claim that Abdallah Aljamal was holding hostages is not credible. This claim was made by the IDF without evidence, and they have a very long history of fabricating post-hoc justifications for killing people they weren’t targeting or supposed to target. Examples include the assassination of American journalist Shireen Abu Akleh in 2022 and the killing of medic Rouzan al-Najjar in 2018. In both cases, the IDF was caught lying to justify their murders, and I don’t think the claims about Abdallah Aljamal hold up at all. From what I read, he lived in the building one of the hostages was recovered from, but he wasn’t known as a target before he was killed. He was characterized as one after he was dead.
Overall, the concept of “valid targets” is bullshit. It is used to assuage our innate understanding that killing people – particularly the young, the innocent, the defenseless, the elderly – is WRONG. Israel has, in this particular war, extended the concept in a way that is clearly genocidal. Their target selection, as covered by 972, was wildly more vicious than their own historical limits on collateral damage. An anonymous Israeli intelligence officer called it “a mass assassination factory”.
I’m glad we agree that all the responsible parties for atrocities deserve to be held accountable. I don’t intend the above as a provocation to fight, but I want to make sure anyone reading this comment section is aware of this context.
There is no denying that IDF did also commit crimes, its a war.
However its very clear that aljazeera journalists are the only ones allowed in Gaza by Hamas, they definitely work together and the case presented by the IDF regarding the journalist seems to be reasonable, even though not independently proven, wich will most likely not happen with more things in this war.
Overall, the concept of “valid targets” is bullshit. It is used to assuage our innate understanding that killing people – particularly the young, the innocent, the defenseless, the elderly – is WRONG. Israel has, in this particular war, extended the concept in a way that is clearly genocidal. Their target selection, as covered by 972, was wildly more vicious than their own historical limits on collateral damage. An anonymous Israeli intelligence officer called it “a mass assassination factory”.
Thats where i don’t agree, there are shit loads of valid targets everywhere and the validation of the targets is by the Geneva conventions. The claim of a genocide is just idiotic. And even when they kill massiv amounts of people, that doesn’t mean those people aren’t working with, for or are terrorists. Also, the “young” are a valid target as soon as they pick up a weapon.
But yes crime needs to be investigated independently and without bias.
There are lots of journalists in Gaza from all over. Where did you get the idea they only allow aljazeera in there? Israel is the one killing reporters btw, not Hamas.
It’s nuts that this is barely even news. Like… another day another atrocity.
I’m trying not to be numb to it, but it’s hard to remain shocked. I’m still disgusted, though.
I’ll say this, too: I think we too often judge wars by the conduct of the participants as though there are good wars and bad ones. And my hunch is that it’s more like there are bad ones and terrible ones, and as awful as this sounds, this one is more notable because it’s being well documented and it involves a uniquely fucked up context (decades of occupation with the support of the US). I think the way the Israeli right wing discusses it is uniquely brazen, and the degree to which the IDF targets journalists and medics seems high, but I think that this kind of stuff happens so often and is undercovered. I wish Yemen got the kind of coverage this is getting.
In terms of the atrocities, I think most wars are basically just a bunch of atrocities in a trenchcoat. It doesn’t make these any better: I just want this to end, and then all the other wars. Fuck this shit.
AND I want the people who do this shit dragged in front of the Hague. I’m very glad that Netanyahu and Gallant have had arrest warrants requested, but you know what I call that? A good start.
You are aware that Hamas literally uses fucking ambulances as transport and that such targets are valid according to the conventions. You are also aware that journalists where found to hold hostages? (https://nypost.com/2024/06/09/world-news/gaza-journalist-held-3-hostages-in-his-home-with-his-family-israeli-military-says/)
Those are valid targets. Oh and also hamas is often just killing or bombing people and saying it was Israel, see the hospital parking lot incident.
However i do agreed that Netanjahu belongs in front of a court. Just as every single hamas terrorist that isn’t killed in this war, justice has to be served no matter how moraly right some of these crimes may seem to some
I really try not to get into litigating each and every instance, but I feel compelled sometimes to point out a few things:
The claim that Abdallah Aljamal was holding hostages is not credible. This claim was made by the IDF without evidence, and they have a very long history of fabricating post-hoc justifications for killing people they weren’t targeting or supposed to target. Examples include the assassination of American journalist Shireen Abu Akleh in 2022 and the killing of medic Rouzan al-Najjar in 2018. In both cases, the IDF was caught lying to justify their murders, and I don’t think the claims about Abdallah Aljamal hold up at all. From what I read, he lived in the building one of the hostages was recovered from, but he wasn’t known as a target before he was killed. He was characterized as one after he was dead.
Overall, the concept of “valid targets” is bullshit. It is used to assuage our innate understanding that killing people – particularly the young, the innocent, the defenseless, the elderly – is WRONG. Israel has, in this particular war, extended the concept in a way that is clearly genocidal. Their target selection, as covered by 972, was wildly more vicious than their own historical limits on collateral damage. An anonymous Israeli intelligence officer called it “a mass assassination factory”.
I’m glad we agree that all the responsible parties for atrocities deserve to be held accountable. I don’t intend the above as a provocation to fight, but I want to make sure anyone reading this comment section is aware of this context.
There is no denying that IDF did also commit crimes, its a war.
However its very clear that aljazeera journalists are the only ones allowed in Gaza by Hamas, they definitely work together and the case presented by the IDF regarding the journalist seems to be reasonable, even though not independently proven, wich will most likely not happen with more things in this war.
Thats where i don’t agree, there are shit loads of valid targets everywhere and the validation of the targets is by the Geneva conventions. The claim of a genocide is just idiotic. And even when they kill massiv amounts of people, that doesn’t mean those people aren’t working with, for or are terrorists. Also, the “young” are a valid target as soon as they pick up a weapon.
But yes crime needs to be investigated independently and without bias.
There are lots of journalists in Gaza from all over. Where did you get the idea they only allow aljazeera in there? Israel is the one killing reporters btw, not Hamas.
Here’s an article with reporters from 3 different networks none of which are aljazeera, and one of which freelancers for NBC and Reuters.
The problem is that Israel can bomb them at any time, and there is no infrastructure to survive as a human, not Hamas. This article also has some other reporters from various publications and networks just trying to survive.
The rest of your comment is pretty abhorrent. They are killing the young before they pick up a weapon. I like how you put “young” in quotes as if this 10 year old is a hardened terrorist soldier that deserves to die. (Warning, starving child picture, NSFL). Read the ICC case It’s very obvious it’s a genocide once you combine their actions with the words. This interview with an Israeli holocaust scholar also gives a good summary of why it’s textbook case of genocide.
The parking lot incident turned out to likely have been israel as originally expected.
And of course the track record of israel bombing every other hospital in Gaza doesn’t help.