You’ll note that I didn’t say that. I said that zionists have no right to be there. They stole Palestinian land, murdered their people, and reduced them to living in a giant open air prison from which they terrorized and bombed them. They deprive them of food water and electricity. They have done their absolute best to eradicate the Palestinian heritage and way of life. They’ve taken again and again and again. They’ve broken every single promise for coexistence. They have no right to be there.

Also, Israel isn’t even a hundred years old. Not even 80. There are original settlers still alive. Most people are second or third generation. It’s not the same as Australia, which was colonized over 200 years ago.

And I’m not proposing that all Israelis be made to leave. In my view zionists and anyone who has been actively involved in the persecution of Palestinians, or in the destruction of the Palestinian nation and heritage, should be made to leave. But I don’t think it should be up to me. It should be up to the Palestinians to determine what happens on their land. And the land that was stolen from them should be returned.

I never made any statement on the legitimacy of anyone’s identity as Jewish. Israel is a country. Israelis are citizens of that country. Jewish people are Jewish people. Israelis are not one and the same with Jewish people.

Jewish people who existed in the region prior to the nakba and the colonization of Palestine were not Israelis. They were not zionists. They coexisted with Muslims in Palestine. Israel was conceived by zionists in Europe. It was a deliberate colonization effort. It didn’t just naturally occur amongst people already living there. Europeans traveled to the region and colonized it, much the same as other Europeans did to North America, Australia, South Asia, etc.

We see all those other colonization efforts as evil and genocidal, which they were. It is much the same with colonization of Palestine. Palestinians should always have had their own nation. They have been told multiple times throughout history both before and after the nakba that they would have their own nation. Israel colonized Palestine and evicted Palestinians from their homes, stole their land from them. They didn’t immigrate to the region to coexist with Palestinians. They came to steal their land, get rid of them, and make their own state on that stolen land.

Zionists? It was zionists who colonized. They did so with the intention of creating a Jewish state.

Decolonization would be… decolonization. Return Palestinian land to the Palestinians. There are still plenty of people alive from the first Nakba. They all deserve their land back. A dissolution of the Israeli state and the creation of a new state of Palestine. Which would necessitate a total dismantling and withdrawal of the entirety of the Israeli state. An international criminal Court to prosecute all crimes against humanity that have ever been committed by the Israeli state. Redistribution of wealth from the Israeli state. How to handle things from there should be up to the new state of Palestine. They have a right to self-determination. Through mediation, but still it should be up to them. It was their land. They have the right to decide what happens with it.

I’d say at the very least the Zionists should go. The entire Israeli state is not composed of zionists. But the entirety of anyone who has ever served in the IDF or the Israeli government should at the least be sent back to the countries they or their fathers came from. Anyone who has participated in the ethnic cleansing of Palestine. Anyone who has murdered Palestinians. They don’t have a right to be there. But, like I said that’s just what I would think is just. It shouldn’t be up to western white people to decide. Palestinians deserve the right to choose what happens with their homes.

I would say the same thing about America or Canada, to be clear. That decolonizing them would be to return land to the Natives and allow them to form their own states and determine what happens with their land. It’s a more complex question of what they should do from there, but it was always their land and they deserve the power to say what happens with it.

And, to be clear, I’m not saying I believe this is what will happen. Merely what I’m saying ought to happen. What actual justice would look like.

Again, Jewish people are not synonymous with Israelis. Those 1.5% Jewish people were not the zionist colonizers. They had existed there prior to Israel. Israel was created by colonizers who espoused the ideology of zionism, that the Jewish religion had a right to it’s own state and that it had the right to take land away from other people to make that state. This ideology is still in practice today. They are slowly committing ethnic cleansing to expand their state. They believe they have a right to significantly more than just Gaza or the West Bank. Which they never had the right to begin with. They displaced millions of people from their homes that had been there for centuries. Millenia in some cases. It is colonization.

Was manifest destiny wrong? Was it wrong for the American settlers to displace native Americans, to steal their land and ethnically cleanse them? Then it is absolutely unequivocally necessarily wrong for the Israelis to do the same to Palestinians.

And so just because there existed discrimination against Jewish people that justifies stealing the land of Palestinian to give them their own state? Why wasn’t one founded anywhere else? Why not colonize somewhere in the middle of Europe? Why not somewhere with sparse population? Why is it fine for them to take Palestinian land and homes and drive them out?

Jewish people are not the same as Israelis. Most Israelis are Jewish, but there are many jewish people who are not Israelis and who are anti-zionist. Colonialism isn’t fine because the colonizers were facing discrimination. That doesn’t justify them committing atrocities and stealing the land of others.

Jewish people have always existed in region, yes. You’ll note that Israel has not always existed in the region. Being Jewish is not synonymous with being an Israeli. The millions of settlers who came to the area to create a Jewish state on Palestinian land were definitionally colonizers. They literally went somewhere that they did not live, somewhere no one in their family had lived, and drove out the people who were already living there. They literally stole homes and stole land from Palestinians living there.

The zionist project began long before WW2. It was not given to them. Palestinians never agreed to giving away their home. The Europeans just did not care if they colonized Palestine or not.

There are lots of dissenting Israelis… but the overwhelming majority of the country is in favor of genocide. The country was founded by colonizing settlers. They went there to steal land and drive out the native peoples living there. Stands to reason colonial racism is a very prominent and popular idea in public opinion.

Yeah I was just gonna say he’s saying this now? As though the settlers just popped up yesterday, as though this hasn’t been a problem since the colonization began.

Israel is committing acts of genocide today against Palestinians. Israel is a settler colonial nation in the same style as 17th/18th century Canada and America. They have always been actively committing atrocities by forcefully relocating and mass murdering the native population of the region, Palestinians.

You are engaging in genocide denialism. Literally denaying the way men women and children are being mass murdered. Israel isnt a country that came to exist out if the diaspora who were living there. It came to exist as a result of mass migration and colonization. From the very beginning Israel has been committing acts of mass violence. Moving a bunch of people into a region to change the demographics of that region and mass displace the people presently living there is genocide. Destroying a culture is genocide. Bombing school, hospitals, is genocide. Shooting children is genocide. Forced mass starvation is genocide. Depriving children of water is genocide.

Look at maps of the Gaza strip. See the amount of it that Israel has declared evacuations on. If there is an evacuation declared for a particular area Israel has free reign in those areas to commit whatever acts of mass violence they choose. The victims must all be hamas, since the evacuation order is there. They will soon declare all but the southern tip evacuated. Settlers are already in the strip. Israel is pushing for one final ejection of Palestinians. One last effort to take their homes forever.

Fuck Benjamin Netanyahu. Fuck the Likud Party. Fuck the IDF. Fuck Israel. And fuck genocide deniers like you, literal conspiracy theorists about genocides being faked. You’re imperialist fascist scum.

Why? Because they both happened in China?

The delivery driver was in desperation because they were going to lose money by being held up by the security guard. They weren’t protesting or demonstrating, just trying to do their job and literally could not afford to wait around. Probably because they are paid a pittance and are paid by the delivery instead of by hour worked. This is also a problem in North America and Europe. Delivery drivers are classified as independent contractors to avoid being given hourly wages and benefits. This incident was a symptom of poor regulation of the delivery industry.

I’m not sure how any of that relates to tank man aside from the fact that both incidents took place somewhere in China. I’m not saying critiquing the Chinese government isn’t worthwhile, but it comes off entirely fangless when you just throw out tank man in a completely unrelated situation. If our goal is better rights and living conditions for workers in China (and everywhere else), the least we can do is actually argue for those things. Criticizing the Chinese state for censoring information on the Tiannamen Square Protests has its place. Doing so here just detracts from the actual subject of the post.

deleted by creator

Again, I can see the possible intent behind this. And I agree that it was most likely not done with the intention of coming across as anti Semitic. But that is how others see it. Read the news articles about it. Look at the comments people have left.

And blood on their hands? Them being what? Jewish people? Are you saying that all Jewish people bear responsibility for the crimes of the state of Israel?

But she was Jewish. She was a Jewish victim of a genocide of jewish people. It is a very prominent opinion that those advocating for Palestinian liberation are promoting a genocide of jewish people.

Re read the first paragraph of the comment you’re responding to. I’m not interested in continuing this conversation if you are entirely incapable of considering how this will be viewed and how this impacts people without our own movement.

Did you miss the part where i said that I understood the intent but am calling out how this makes our movement look like fucking neo nazis? Do you want to re read what I’ve said please before throwing more baseless accusations at me?

No I wouldn’t give a shit if they painted pro Palestine messages on any non-holocaust related memorials. Because that wouldn’t make us look like neo nazis. This does. People are going to talk about this on the news today and millions of people will shake their head and lend more credence to claims that we are antisemites. And Jewish anti zionists now know that due to their religion some anti zionists are entirely willing to throw them under a bus in the name of “rattling cages”.

They did and they were wrong but his walks also did not bolster claims of anti semitism by defacing memorials to holocaust victims

To be clear, totally down with civil unrest. This is not civil unrest. This is defacing a statue of a universally known holocaust victim. A victim who was a helpless child.

Rattling the cage of “innocent victims of genocide” is literally the last fucking cage anyone should ever rattle like what are you talking about. This is the shit that neo nazis do. This action puts us in league with neonazis in the mind of the majority of the public like what do you mean?? Also how is defacing genocide victim statues doing anything to further our cause of international recognition of the genocide of Palestinian?

Break some windows. Civil unrest, fight back against the states that support this genocide. No question yea do that. Don’t deface Anne Franke statues like I genuinely can’t even believe this has to be said. Again, how do you think this makes jewish anti-zionists feel? Does this make them feel welcome in our movement?

I get that angle, I do. I just question whether the statement works or not. Do you think the majority of people will interpret these actions that way? Do you think this will paint a good picture of anti-zionist action to the wider international public? Drop the “pro-palestinian” part and the headline reads like probably neo-nazi action. And I do firmly believe that’s how it will be interpreted. I’m a revolutionary leftist like I’m all for taking action this action just serves not to advance the cause but actually to degrade it. This action legitimizes accusations of anti semitism levied at anti zionists. That is exactly how it will be interpreted that is the exact story they will tell.

They’ll always try and accuse us of being antisemitic, see the college protests for example. But that was contentious like the public was not united in opposition to that because protesting on campus is not on its face value antisemitic. But defacing a statue of a girl who was murdered in a genocide of jewish people does NOT come across as anti-zionist action. We do NOT have to stir up outrage over disrespecting holocaust victims to advocate for Palestinian liberation.

Not to mention can we not have some respect for Jewish people within our movement? How do you think this makes them feel? An innocent girl who died due to virulent antisemitic hatred being brought into a conflict over another genocide. Jewish people tell us they don’t always feel safe in leftist circles. This is also not helping that in any way

How wildly misguided and disrespectful. That is assuming this was even done in earnest. Accusations of anti semitism are levied at anti-zionist action all the time and it’s hard to dismiss those accusations when legitimate anti-semitism frequently tries to associate itself with anti-zionism.

I’m not even saying this couldn’t have been done by a legitimate anti-zionist who is also antisemitic. It just continually weakens the cause of anti colonialism when other forms of bigotry crop up around us. Anti semitism in all it’s forms is completely abhorrent and unacceptable. Advocating for the liberation of Palestinians should never invoke anti-Semitic ideology.

Edit: if you’re curious how antisemitism could come to exist in leftist movements, read the comments below. Giving no thought to the impact our actions have is unacceptable. Pissing people off is not a worthy trade for making Jewish leftists feel unsafe in our movements.